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PostPosted: Tue Dec 11, 2018 10:11 pm 
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Ok, but I may have to talk to myself on here then.......I sometimes do! lOl


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 12, 2018 11:33 am 
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edd wrote:
Ok, but I may have to talk to myself on here then.......I sometimes do! lOl


Nah it's fine Edd,

I'm over myself again.

Go ahead, where were we "philosophical physics or something?".

Is this where we start making things up to suit our own points of view?

Remember to write Buell at some point ok.

All the bets Paul.

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PostPosted: Fri Dec 14, 2018 2:47 pm 
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No need to make things up. I just rediscovered my copies of ‘explaining the unexplained’ by J.Eysenck & C. Sargent. They have a good stab at things on the fringe! ;)

Obviously there is more to ‘energy’ healing than just standing with hands outstretched sensing the aura. Like most things you have to ‘work it’ to take things to the next level. This is where the ‘o’ level sceptical physicists kick off at seminars or discussions; “ that defies all the laws of science”. What laws exactly? :roll: Anyway, there are doctors and physicists who do healing and who don’t seem to have a problem. ;)

The notion of a signal carrier shouldn’t be difficult to grasp, or how do homing pigeons ‘home’? And why do birds have an apparent aversion to microwave radiation? Maybe they just dislike the aesthetics of vertical array housings? lOl

It’s when you start talking about premonitions that things get a bit too ‘fuzzy’ for conventional science.
How do you perceive an event prior to it’s cause? This conflicts with the ‘arrow of time’......or does it? :?


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PostPosted: Fri Dec 14, 2018 3:48 pm 
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edd wrote:
No need to make things up. I just rediscovered my copies of ‘explaining the unexplained’ by J.Eysenck & C. Sargent. They have a good stab at things on the fringe! ;)

Obviously there is more to ‘energy’ healing than just standing with hands outstretched sensing the aura. Like most things you have to ‘work it’ to take things to the next level. This is where the ‘o’ level sceptical physicists kick off at seminars or discussions; “ that defies all the laws of science”. What laws exactly? :roll: Anyway, there are doctors and physicists who do healing and who don’t seem to have a problem. ;)

The notion of a signal carrier shouldn’t be difficult to grasp, or how do homing pigeons ‘home’? And why do birds have an apparent aversion to microwave radiation? Maybe they just dislike the aesthetics of vertical array housings? lOl

It’s when you start talking about premonitions that things get a bit too ‘fuzzy’ for conventional science.
How do you perceive an event prior to it’s cause? This conflicts with the ‘arrow of time’......or does it? :?


Hi Edd,

I think energy healing, when called that, is where problems arise.
If you said water divining that doesn't seem to get the same response & as previously mentioned has been tried by some people on here with success.
I personally feel that empathic response is probably more likely as it has it's basis in Caring, but as you say scientifically measuring this is nigh on impossible.
This may well be the same inner energy you're describing, or Signal carrier as you say maybe? Empathy definitely works in Gestalt Psychotherapy & is pretty well documented as a healing force, although truly understood? I don't think so, words aren't enough. I've read no end of books that mention empathy, but none that really describe the actual active force. Just that it is a thing & it works.
So the problem I see here, is explaining these concepts using the English language & not the actual concepts themselves that you talk about.

I thought we were keeping this on one thing at a time Edd?

I think there may be an explanation of why birds "home" & swallows make it to places like S. Africa, I believe it may be something to do with Magnetics but not sure.

Microwave radiation? Is that what my kitchen microwave produces? I'm really not keen on that myself never minds the birds. It's ok for warming up yesterdays chilli, but when you start to look at the wavelengths etc & how they manage to stay contained in the box. My only interest is in the fact that they stay in there & don't sterilise my Nads, although I've got to admit my interest is waning there also as I succumb to my own "arrow of time".

Premonitions, I just have no idea fuzzy or otherwise, never had one so very limited experience & not really able to comment because of this. I think that those probably belong in horror movies myself, but just my opinion.

All the best Paul.

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PostPosted: Fri Dec 14, 2018 10:12 pm 
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I am trying to keep things to one thing and all the points l made relate to that one thing. I am trying to explain or reach some conclusion of what nature of signal carrier is being used in healing/dowsing/telepathy etc by the human brain. :?

The birds analogy is just using examples to show how other animals in nature are using some form of signal carrier to find their bearings or as a defensive mechanism. The homing pigeon may be using earths magnetic fields. Birds seem to avoid mobile phone masts, which l thought transmitted microwave signals.

Healing or energy healing are just words to describe an activity, but empathy does not describe what we do in our minds to transmit or interact with that sensation with another person. I did have a number of altered state experiences in my youth which on reflection may have been relevant, but at the time l just wanted to get over them. The night visitor was one.....

During my first term at Holbrook school near Ipswich, l went down with severe Bronchitis and was running a high fever. I was put in the school infirmary the first night. All alone in the first bed inside the door of a dormitory of 22 beds my head was burning up, only cooled by regular quaffing of cold orange juice. :ill:
At one point l was looking down the dorm with my fingers on the edge of the pillow and l was instantaneously in all the other beds lying on my side looking back at myself in the first bed. Scary or what? But l could look back at myself from a remote position, or many remote positions where my actual head was not!
I have since heard of similar experiences from other people who were in altered states of consciousness. So what is or was going on here?

I have also read about psychic research experiments concerning esp or PK at a distance. There was an infamous story of Eastern Block scientists who took some baby rabbits down under the artic ocean in a submarine while their mother was kept in a laboratory inland. At a predetermined time the babies were killed and the mother rabbits response was monitored. Allegedly the mother reacted at the same instant her poor offspring were exterminated. Cruel or what? But..........:sad1:

There is a theory that the esp element is not conditional on distance. Some would argue that if separation is not a determinate factor, then neither is time! I am not so sure about the latter. A signal only need travel at the speed of light......as would the electrical signals in the brain of Ms Bunny. But how did those signals travel the distance? :?


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 15, 2018 12:54 am 
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Hi Edd,

Jesus! What happened to staying with one thing at a time?

So let me try & get this straight.

Are we attempting to look at (or for) the carrier signal you think we have in our minds that may relay what you think may be ESP?

Is that what we're trying to look at?

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PostPosted: Sat Dec 15, 2018 8:20 am 
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Jazzbutcher wrote:
Hi Edd,

Jesus! What happened to staying with one thing at a time?

So let me try & get this straight.

Are we attempting to look at (or for) the carrier signal you think we have in our minds that may relay what you think may be ESP?

Is that what we're trying to look at?




YES! lOl


But l am being both serious and provocative. Not about the signal, but the medium through which a signal would travel. It may not be a medium, but a sort of abstract condition of particle physics???

The human brain seems to possess some of these abilities. I can see a reasoning that ESP or healing or dowsing at close proximity to ones own body may not be anything so fantastic and could simply be a tuning in to localised natural electrical fields, magnetism call it what you will. But activities more distant or remote from ones own brain are more likely to be something else. :?

If we can view or contact information more remotely, or dare l say it have actual premonitions then the weird nature of particle physics would surely have to come into play? :shock:


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 15, 2018 12:25 pm 
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edd wrote:
Jazzbutcher wrote:
Hi Edd,

Jesus! What happened to staying with one thing at a time?

So let me try & get this straight.

Are we attempting to look at (or for) the carrier signal you think we have in our minds that may relay what you think may be ESP?

Is that what we're trying to look at?




YES! lOl


But l am being both serious and provocative. Not about the signal, but the medium through which a signal would travel. It may not be a medium, but a sort of abstract condition of particle physics???

The human brain seems to possess some of these abilities. I can see a reasoning that ESP or healing or dowsing at close proximity to ones own body may not be anything so fantastic and could simply be a tuning in to localised natural electrical fields, magnetism call it what you will. But activities more distant or remote from ones own brain are more likely to be something else. :?

If we can view or contact information more remotely, or dare l say it have actual premonitions then the weird nature of particle physics would surely have to come into play? :shock:


Hi Edd,

I know you're being serious, never doubted that.

So, can we call this medium a carrier wave?

I'm pretty sure waves fit squarely within physics again.

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PostPosted: Sat Dec 15, 2018 7:49 pm 
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Sounds good to me. ;)

An opinion from Dave the Astronomer might progress things?! :?


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PostPosted: Sun Dec 16, 2018 9:59 pm 
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I have been trying to understand the complexities of the Einstein-Podolsky-Rosen (EPR) paradox!

In particular the influence of observer and partially and temporal invariance of collapse of the state vector! :ill: unfortunately l only seem to be able to concentrate on 2 things at any one time max! Whilst the appreciation of such complex matters seems to require a concentration level of 3! lOl

It seems that l will need to grasp all these things before understanding a link between esp and quantum physics if one exists. However, one Nobel laureate Brian Josephson has stated that; if psi events had never been reported, an imaginative theoretician could have predicted from quantum theory that psi events should occur! ;)

Must read more....... :coat:


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 17, 2018 12:33 pm 
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Hi Edd,
I'm reading & watching a lot of stuff regarding Quantum Gravity, Emergence theory & Pixelated reality.
This is the most interesting thing I've looked at so far & I like it a lot as it kind of goes along with my way of thinking, that nothing we see is real.

(It's ok folks I'm not going off my head again)

The Book Dave FS recommended is interesting in that I had no idea how long people had been looking at this stuff, or how most of the theories kind of end up focusing towards the same end point via differing routes. I'm still only about 90 pages into it though, I find it hard reading anything & making sense of it. This book is hard going, like wading through a muddy swamp, but like an overview & understandable generally because of this. I'll send it on to you when I've read it if you like, although may be months yet as I'm only a third of the way through heh heh.

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PostPosted: Mon Dec 17, 2018 4:20 pm 
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The first words that are read by seekers of enlightenment in the secret, gong-banging, yeti-haunted valleys near the hub of the world, are when they look into The Life of Wen the Eternally Surprised.

The first question they ask is: 'Why was he eternally surprised?'

And they are told: 'Wen considered the nature of time and understood that the universe is, instant by instant, recreated anew. Therefore, he understood, there is in truth no past, only a memory of the past. Blink your eyes, and the world you see next did not exist when you closed them. Therefore, he said, the only appropriate state of the mind is surprise. The only appropriate state of the heart is joy. The sky you see now, you have never seen before. The perfect moment is now. Be glad of it.'

The first words read by the young Lu-Tze when he sought perplexity in the dark, teeming, rain-soaked city of Ankh-Morpork were: 'Rooms For Rent, Very Reasonable.' And he was glad of it.”
― Terry Pratchett, Thief of Time

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PostPosted: Mon Dec 17, 2018 6:42 pm 
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Nutah wrote:
The first words that are read by seekers of enlightenment in the secret, gong-banging, yeti-haunted valleys near the hub of the world, are when they look into The Life of Wen the Eternally Surprised.

The first question they ask is: 'Why was he eternally surprised?'

And they are told: 'Wen considered the nature of time and understood that the universe is, instant by instant, recreated anew. Therefore, he understood, there is in truth no past, only a memory of the past. Blink your eyes, and the world you see next did not exist when you closed them. Therefore, he said, the only appropriate state of the mind is surprise. The only appropriate state of the heart is joy. The sky you see now, you have never seen before. The perfect moment is now. Be glad of it.'

The first words read by the young Lu-Tze when he sought perplexity in the dark, teeming, rain-soaked city of Ankh-Morpork were: 'Rooms For Rent, Very Reasonable.' And he was glad of it.”
― Terry Pratchett, Thief of Time


I think Wen (whoever he was) was pretty much on it, or in it, ha ha.

Profound indeed.

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PostPosted: Mon Dec 17, 2018 6:56 pm 
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:mrgreen:

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PostPosted: Mon Dec 17, 2018 6:58 pm 
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I thought you were quoting from the Tibetan Book of the Dead there Don lOl

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