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 Post subject: Re: Son of The Grenade
PostPosted: 17 Aug 2012 00:13 
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Think Pink
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pash wrote:
Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaarrrrrrrrrrrrgggggggggggggggghhhhhhhhhh

:ner: wb :D

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IF IT BLEEDS WE CAN KILL IT ,THIS STUFF WILL MAKE YOU A GODDAM SEXUAL TYRANASURUS ,YOUVE BEEN PUSHING TOO MANY PENCILS DILLON .GET TO THE CHOPPER


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 Post subject: Re: Son of The Grenade
PostPosted: 17 Aug 2012 07:40 
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proff. patpending
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Current ride: Victoria Sponge
Location: Bristol - Gateway to all things good
How embarrassing, we are now in Buell Chat.

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 Post subject: Re: Son of The Grenade
PostPosted: 17 Aug 2012 11:15 
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proff. patpending
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Current ride: Victoria Sponge
Location: Bristol - Gateway to all things good
I had a few PMs asking me about the master cylinder. I am using a 5/8 bore Nissin from a 96/97 S1 (PM caliper), which I got on US EBay, with Shell DOT 5.1 fluid. The rebuild kits for these are no longer available, but they are the same as some Kawasaki models.

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 Post subject: Re: Son of The Grenade
PostPosted: 17 Aug 2012 12:20 
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Current ride: XB9SX
Mickrick wrote:
Oh! hang on.... that car was a Nova was it not?.... lOl


1389cc Carrborrettorrrr!.....for the technically minded. lOl


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 Post subject: Re: Son of The Grenade
PostPosted: 17 Aug 2012 19:13 
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proff. patpending
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Joined: 06 May 2009 20:20
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Current ride: Victoria Sponge
Location: Bristol - Gateway to all things good
pash wrote:
The rebuild kits for these are no longer available, but they are the same as some Kawasaki models.

Kawasaki part numbers (TBD):
43020 PISTON-COMP-BRAKE,FR £33.34
49016 COVER-SEAL,MASTER CYL £4.90
43022 STOPPER-BRAKE,PISTON £1.91

Yamaha part number (TBD):
4K0-W0041-50

Suzuki part numbers (TBD):
59600-45860 PISTON/CUP SET

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 Post subject: Re: Son of The Grenade
PostPosted: 17 Aug 2012 19:17 
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Joined: 06 May 2009 13:55
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Current ride: GTR1000 Rocket,550GT
Location: Joondalup
pash wrote:
How embarrassing, we are now in Buell Chat.


Could be worse, you could be in the Test Track lOl

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 Post subject: Re: Son of The Grenade
PostPosted: 18 Aug 2012 09:53 
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Posts: 623
Location: West Country
You'll be in obituaries when you start it up

Tick......tick.......tick

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 Post subject: Re: Son of The Grenade
PostPosted: 20 Aug 2012 11:47 
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proff. patpending
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Joined: 06 May 2009 20:20
Posts: 14705
Current ride: Victoria Sponge
Location: Bristol - Gateway to all things good
pash wrote:
pash wrote:
The rebuild kits for these are no longer available, but they are the same as some Kawasaki models.

Kawasaki part numbers (TBD):
43020 PISTON-COMP-BRAKE,FR £33.34
49016 COVER-SEAL,MASTER CYL £4.90
43022 STOPPER-BRAKE,PISTON £1.91

Yamaha part number (TBD):
4K0-W0041-50

Suzuki part numbers (TBD):
59600-45860 PISTON/CUP SET


Just been on the phone to Fowlers, the Yamaha set is £40, the Suzuki £28 but... they have genuine Nissin sets at £11.50 :shock:

Will be investigating later this week, and look for 1/2" bore repair kits (XBs and 98 and later tubers). May also see them about caliper seals...

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 Post subject: Re: Son of The Grenade
PostPosted: 20 Aug 2012 12:06 
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A grey tide eel
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Posts: 1853
Location: Bristol
Shame their not still available from Harley that could push the price for the same item into triple figures

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 Post subject: Re: Son of The Grenade
PostPosted: 20 Aug 2012 12:12 
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proff. patpending
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Posts: 14705
Current ride: Victoria Sponge
Location: Bristol - Gateway to all things good
Bet the XB ones are not cheap...

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 Post subject: Re: Son of The Grenade
PostPosted: 20 Aug 2012 20:09 
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proff. patpending
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Joined: 06 May 2009 20:20
Posts: 14705
Current ride: Victoria Sponge
Location: Bristol - Gateway to all things good
pash wrote:
pash wrote:
pash wrote:
The rebuild kits for these are no longer available, but they are the same as some Kawasaki models.

Kawasaki part numbers (TBD):
43020 PISTON-COMP-BRAKE,FR £33.34
49016 COVER-SEAL,MASTER CYL £4.90
43022 STOPPER-BRAKE,PISTON £1.91

Yamaha part number (TBD):
4K0-W0041-50

Suzuki part numbers (TBD):
59600-45860 PISTON/CUP SET


Just been on the phone to Fowlers, the Yamaha set is £40, the Suzuki £28 but... they have genuine Nissin sets at £11.50 :shock:

Will be investigating later this week, and look for 1/2" bore repair kits (XBs and 98 and later tubers). May also see them about caliper seals...


This really needs its own thread...

Went to my local Nissin stockist, where I found the following:

MCBK58 (suit 6 pot PM caliper tuber) - 5/8" bore master cylinder repair kit - £9.16 + VAT
MCBK12 (suit 6 pot Nissin caliper tuber and XB) - 1/2" bore master cylinder repair kit - £9.16 + VAT

There will of course be a kit for a 19mm bore to suit the 8 piston calipers, but I didn't have a master cylinder to match up with me...

Couple that with the ability to buy the rubber boot on the back of the piston, you know the one, near the heel of the lever that always deteriorates... £1.66 + VAT - a lot for such a small part, but I wouldn't know where to buy them...

Just to milk the post further, the Buell part number with the corresponding Nissin part number...

45185-98Y = MCBK12
N0220.F = MCBK12
45185-96Y = MCBK58

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 Post subject: Re: Son of The Grenade
PostPosted: 30 Sep 2012 21:52 
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proff. patpending
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Posts: 14705
Current ride: Victoria Sponge
Location: Bristol - Gateway to all things good
Too many projects and lack of sub-tier supplier time mean SoG has been resting in the corner (Albert666 is making me some headers).

On another of my tubers, with Thunderstorm heads, I suffered a double exhaust stud failure, and despite attempting to drill them out using a jig, I ended up having to remove the head, stick it on the mill and then drill them out.

Whilst the head was off, I decided to have a brief look at what it would take to pull the squish down...

With the cylinder pulled down on the base gasket...

Image

...and a bit of imagination, the piston crown is level with the top of the cylinder (it is fractions of a mm lower, but lets not split [thick] hairs).

And looking at the combustion chamber...

Image

...it has a step 0.9mm deep in the head.

The rule of thumb for a Buell engine that revs to 7000rpm is that the optimum squish clearance is 0.75mm, but we can't even reach that with no head gasket... :?

The head gasket itself is 1.3mm thick when squashed which gives us a 2.3mm clearance.

So, options (don't look :maz: ):

1. Assemble the cylinders with no base gaskets and use instant gasket
2. Machine 0.9mm off the cylinder head
3. Get some XB heads and machine a 15deg squish band
4. Get some XB heads and fit XB pistons
5. Put it all back together and sell the bike on

I bet all 98-02 engines are like this...
:couch:

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 Post subject: Re: Son of The Grenade
PostPosted: 16 Feb 2013 20:14 
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proff. patpending
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Joined: 06 May 2009 20:20
Posts: 14705
Current ride: Victoria Sponge
Location: Bristol - Gateway to all things good
Back to the S1... I have been slowly getting it together to take it for an MOT, but the cold weather has not given me much interest in going into the garage.

I had the engine running a few weeks ago, and when I tried it again last week to take it for an MOT it wouldn't start. Grrrr. No spark.

Anyway, I have been trawling through the wires, and I think my biggest problem has been oxidation on the relay and fuse terminals. Some cleaning, then silicon grease and lots of push in, wiggle, take out etc. has got me some good contacts with considerable less voltage drop at the feed to the ignition unit.

Whilst doing this, I thought I would have a play with my oscilloscope from that well known manufacturer Rigol :twisted:

It connects to my PC as well as having a USB slot. To be honest I have little knowledge of how to use it, but it does loads of stuff and the guys in the lab at work were well impressed with it. In reality I think it is a copy of a Tektronix.

Anyway, connected it up to the CPS and coil to look at the ignition events:
Image Image Image

I captured a scope trace (I am still trying to get my head round how to do this well).
Image

The yellow is the CPS, the drop corresponds to the gap in the rotor passing through the sensor. The blue is the voltage at the coil, and as all of you know, the spark is caused by the collapse of the magnetic field on the primary side, generating a rise in magnetic field on the secondary and a rise in voltage until the spark jumps from one electrode to the other. In fact, those eagled eyed people will see that the scope is connected the wrong way around on the coil as the dwell time (12V charge time) finishes at the point the spark is initiated (the spike - which is the collapse of the magnetic field on the secondary inducing a voltage on the primary).

You can get some info off the plot, such as engine speed and ignition timing...

So, the engine speed can be calculated from the time taken to complete a full revolution of the CPS rotor, it has two cut outs, so you need to count the time between the first and third rising edges. I reckon that is 130ms (20ms per square). One full revolution of the CPS is two crank revs, so it is 65ms per crank rev. 1/0.065 = 15.385 revs per second or 923.077 revs per minute.

You can also work out the ignition timing by calculating the number of degrees between the spark and the rising edge of the CPS. So I reckon that is 4ms (you really need a smaller timebase to do this accurately). Time per degree of rotation = 130 ms / 720 degrees = 180us, so 4ms is 22 deg crank angle, which is about right for my ignition box with the VOES operational.

The funny thing is, none of this is new by any means. When I was a kid bombing around the estate on my 12" wheel bicycle, I used to see a van from time to time with wires coming out of the back connected to a car with an open bonnet with a guy opening the throttle with his hand. Once, I asked the guy what he was doing, and he said 'I am doing a Crypton Tune'. Wow, I thought. Best tell my dad... Anyway, IIRC, the guy with the van had a scope in the back and looked at the operation of points (remember them) and displaying the same as I am above.

I think Sun took the lead with this sort of kit, and Crypton (or TI Crypton) died a death.

But are there mechanics still using these great tools? I dunno, Rik will tell us, but I think the real answer is that cars are so sophisticated now that you just swap bits out rather than tinkering with electromechanical parts to get best performance <sigh>

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 Post subject: Re: Son of The Grenade
PostPosted: 18 Feb 2013 11:29 
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Joined: 08 Apr 2010 20:05
Posts: 623
Location: West Country
Have you got any pictures of SOG in all it's finery?

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 Post subject: Re: Son of The Grenade
PostPosted: 18 Feb 2013 11:51 
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proff. patpending
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Joined: 06 May 2009 20:20
Posts: 14705
Current ride: Victoria Sponge
Location: Bristol - Gateway to all things good
Went out on it yesterday but not far as it is not taxed and MOTed...

When done ill take some snaps...

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